A True Definition Of MMA: A Very Unpopular Opinion

[sanjuro_ronin]

I do agree with Sanjuro that the typical MMA fighter is a much better fighter than the typical TCMA practitioner. In fact, even a competitive moderate to full-contact, non-MMA, TCMA fighter will be a better fighter than most TCMAists who haven't fought competitively. It's really about reactions and mindset under pressure.

Of course, there are MMA fighters who cannot make the transition to a street fighting mindset, but a high percentage of TMAists are the same, whether they practice the 'dirtier' or 'deadly' moves or not. Those same dirty or deadly moves are also available for the sport fighter as well, and many are fully aware of them.

TBH, I really don't get the disdain that each side (sport MMA and TMA) has for each other. It's silly. "The enemy" are the various threats that can happen unexpectedly, whether on the street, in the home, in your car, in a crowded environment, etc. ANYONE can "get got", no matter your training or lack of. If some psychopath goes on a shooting rampage, whether you are MMA, TMA or not, you'd better try to run and hide your @ss. There are many scenarios that typical MMA and TMA do not address adequately, if at all.

Quite correct.
IMO, MMA is simply a venue to be used to test your skills and ALL, including TCMA, should use it.
No real good reason NOT to use it.

[Hakaider]

While I think you both have a point...

I politely disagree.

Firstly, limiting rules doesn't mean you will be amazing with no rules. They are different sciences and focuses. If I say to you, our rules are limited to having a pillow fight. Just because you are the pillow fighting champion doesn't mean you can suddenly destroy people in a real fight. How you train is how you fight and what is possible involves a lot of study. Being good at limited rules doesn't mean you can suddenly beat others with expanded rules. It just means you are good at fighting a certain method. Science and knowledge with experience dictates everything. Your example is like me playing street fighter 3 third strike. I say to my friend, we can only shoot fireballs. He can beat me everytime. That's different from having a full on match in the game. If am used to using a wider range skillset and he has these fire ball matches, he will lose.

You remind of when some shady Sanda organization have their annual Sanda vs. Muay Thai matches. They always tell the Muay Thai guys: "no knees and elbows allowed." So, the Sanda guys have a better chance to win a what they are good at. Just because you fight in MMA doesn't mean you have deep science. MMA is not an MA or scientific method. It's just a fighting competition with rules that support a certain type of fighting style. For example: I study grappling extensively. Certain forms of grappling is a lot less risky in MMA in terms of punishment, so using it is a huge advantage.

In terms of the average TCMA vs MMA skillwise in a fight:

It's rather hard to quantify, the average this or that. The main issue is that we haven't met all MMA or TCMA people. There are certainly a large number of fraudelunt people in both areas. When referring to science and systems, MMA has none. Any of it's usefulness will come from TMA. MMA has no science other than the idea of cross training which is not new, but is it's main selling point. It's hard to compare them as they are completely different. MMA is ONLY a fighting competition. It offers no curriculum or skillset because it's not an MA. The skills largely derive from the TMA people you learn from. TCMA is a very deep set of fighting systems that were used in war that include a large set of tested sciences on the battlefield. They are two different mindsets and paths.

As to why some TMA people can't fight. One word: frauds and those misled by frauds. TMA was a huge marketed cash cow in the same vein of MMA currently. Many so called masters appeared to make fast money. These guys got called out and got wrecked and many of them have backed down largely. In terms of TMA, how many people are legit in places like America, Uk and so on... That is hard to know. With the vast amount of systems in existence, only a fraction actually exist in the west to begin with. Of those small portions, many frauds are looking to a quick buck. However, there are legit and skillfull people out there despite some of the phonies.

It's kinda rediculous to say average this or that because there is no real way to actually base this off of anything.The world is full of TMA practioners, where do you think MMA trainers need to get some collective basic skills from . With that said, with so many people out there around the world and a wide range of fighting styles, it's hard to make a definitive statement on who can beat who.

If you want to talk about the MMA community as a collective. There are many people who wash out of MMA or try it for a year. In terms of business retention, a gym is a gym with a majority of people washing out after 3 to 6 months. Most people getting into it will never become high level or even learn deep combative knowledge. That comprises a huge amount of people. So, it's hard to claim a vast majority of people in MMA can fight. Hell a few of the top UFC champs can admit their science wasn't very deep. They train to win belts, not to become combat generals. The juicing and rampant cheating doesn't help their cause.

Frauds are now appearing in MMA as well. It has become flooded with many more McMMA gyms and people looking to cash in. I have been to places where people are learning absolute hot garbage. In fact opening an MMA gym is quite easy and there no governing body and since MMA has no set curriculum it is quite easy to scam people. In fact, making the switch from being a TMA scam artists into an MMA scam artist is not too hard. It may be even more profitable.

I do agree with Jimbo in regard to having peace between MMA and TMA. I think the big issue when both MMA and TMA taken out of reality by bigots, keyboard warriors and elitism from frauds on both sides. However, we can't deny that MMA is a huge business and as much they may not admit it, they would much rather reduce TMA in terms of market share and influence. Any possible dent in the illusion that MMA is home to the world's greatest and deepest combatants is seen as blasphemy.

If you wipe away all of frauds and bs, you come to realization. You go to various TMA sciences to learn how to utilize and study combative knowledge/skills. If you are not learning combat, then you have a fraud teaching you... You go to MMA to fight in an attempt to win a belt or title. MMA is not an MA, it an opportunity (for many) to test a collective mixed subset of mostly unmastered skills (derived from TMA), geared towards ENTERTAINMENT that provides people with a nice collection of life long injuries and feeling of being a badass for 1000 bucks on a good night.

[SoCo KungFu]

I will not always reply against rabid MMA fans as I used to be one. I know there is very little reasoning with them.

Translation: I don't have anything to back up my claims so I'm going home. And genetic fallacy.

About TCMA guys getting beaten up by MMA guys. It's great marketing and supports MMA as a financial institution. No different than the other fighting fads or crazes of the past claiming to be the pinnacle. Here is why you are incorrect in your assessment.

No, its ****ing demonstrable reality. Don't be an idiot.

1. Masters of Ancient War

In ancient times, soldiers fought on a battle ground using kung fu as a very formidable science.

Nothing you have done in kungfu is adapted for battlefield use. Civilian self defense and warfare are two totally different things. Neither of which do you seem to know jack **** about.

They were jacked and extremely skilled. One man killing 10 with hand to hand combat.

If you want to talk about your larper fantasies or world of Warcraft, take your **** to the off topic forum

I believe these masters would destroy most MMA fighters with precision. But, that comparison doesn't make too much sense as MMA fighters are not trained or focused on such things. Additionally, a lot of fake Kung fu fraudulent schools have moved away from their combative roots and sciences. If they ever understood them in the first place...

You're pleading. And look stupid.

2. Geographically and historically, it's an illogical statement.

In order for your statement to be true, that means somehow MMA fighters travelled to Asia, located and beat down every Kung Fu Master and Hybrid Kung Fu practioner like philipino, malaysian and vietnamese masters. There are hundreds of different styles with tons of sub-systems with kung fu at their core or are influenced by them. So, I haven't seen all these guys destroyed. Until, this is the case... your statement is full of lies and fluff. But, it is marketable.

Moving the goal post and argument from ignorance

3. Getting into and becoming an MMA fighter doesn't have some high criteria or benchmark to meet.

Then larpers should be all up in the cage. Funny how that isn't the case... This is also irrelevant to you opening argument.

Kimbo Slice has deep combat knowledge like Ms. Piggy has anorexia. Dada 5000 had a heart attack moving around in a ring.

And both of those people have done what 99% of traditional, martial artists never do, BEFORE they stepped into an actual cage.

Connor Mcgregor is only a brown belt in bjj

Only.... and also, still irrelevant

and is looking for a big pay day to get out of the sport asap. RR was clearly someone who may have had a few hand picked fighters or cans.

And I take it, you regularly go up against people that are the objectively demonstrable best fighters around in whatever biological designation you happen to be?

John Jones said it best: "The best guys are not in the octogon. The guys who train me are far skilled than I am."

Clearly you totally missed is point.

Combative science goes far deeper than making someone tap.

No one argued against this. Interestingly, YOU are the moron trying to build a myopic strawman to flail against.

Since, the skill level of fighters in MMA is all over the place to quite low, it further solidifies the idea that MMA isn't a martial art in itself and can't really measure a form of high level combat competence.

In what ****ing world does joining the red with the blue make a logical statement? You know, your apparent inability to demonstrate basic reasoning is the best evidence you've presented thus far that you actually have experience getting punched in the head...

If the green is true, then kung fu is far worse.

4. Random Youtube videos don't mean much...

When I was an MMA-fanatic, I had very limited knowledge of what was really out there. I always showed the videos of guys getting killed by MMA fighters. Me and my buddies would laugh and wear our UFC shirts. Many around me were quick to say all TMA were frauds. Upon doing further research, I realized there are a lot of frauds in existence, but there quite a large amount of legit combative guys out there. Unfortunately, many legit guys got a bad and unfair label because a few childish challenges. On the flipside, there are plenty of MMA frauds in existence now because MMA is a cash cow. With my skill set, I could probably hurt a few people. I can film it and put it on youtube and then write: Kung Fu beats MMA. I wouldn't do that because it would make me a tool, MMA is not a fighting style and the entire business community of MMA would hate me. That action in itself would take away potential customers from McMMA gyms by presenting MMA as not the end all be all. Even the Kung Fu community would probably dislike me for bringing unwanted challenges as a swarm of MMA knuckleheads may be looking to beat up the first "kung fu master" they see to regain dignity. Yet, none of this proves anything... Why? Those videos and skills can be produced rather easily to portray anyone as a badass. At the end of the day, those videos don't really mean much or prove much.

You're pleading again.

5. I fought and won. Nuff said.

I come from a traditional backgroud. I am proud of my heritage.

So does everyone else here, you're not special.

I didn't say I was an MMA fighter, when I fought in MMA matches.

No one gives a ****.

[quote]This irked some people, but I didn't care./quote]
I doubt they lost sleep. You're not that important.

I proudly stood up for my art and adapted my skills to fight againt MMA fighters and I won.

So says every other larper that shows up here.

It proves that you don't have to throw your traditional style under bus and start calling yourself MMA in order to gain respect.

Another strawman

I don't even have beef with MMA fighters or their community.

No one ****ing cares. You're attempting to qualify your opinion by appealing to emotion rather than just simply making a ****ing logical argument.

I still train with my best friend who is an MMA guy.

I'm not racist, I have a lot of black friends but......

I just don't respect guys who are lazy, got punched in the face, lacked the diligence to obtain deep knowledge and suddenly threw their entire style under a bus and say, "I'm MMA" as if it denotes they are untouchable now.

Yet you seem to be the only one making this case....

I won several matches. I learned to adapt and deal with various types of resistence using my style as a base. I rep my style and I build upon it and explore it scientifically. I may not line the wallets of the MMA business machine by doing that, but I don't care. They have enough cash anyway...

Want a cookie?


Edit:

scientific method

You keep using this phrase like you ****ing think you know what it means. As an actual, experienced scientist, you don't ****ing understand the 1st thing about empiricism and hypothesis testing. If you did, this idiotic thread wouldn't have been started and you'd be out training with all these fighters you supposedly know, rather than coming here to make yourself look like an idiot.

MMA is empirical (science). STFU and go do it. Or go take your larp ass off to play age of wushu.

[SoCo KungFu]

You go to MMA to fight in an attempt to with(sic) a belt or title. MMA is not a science, it an opportunity to test a collective mixed subset of mostly unmastered skills (derived from TMA).

Ignoring your unsubstantiated emphasis I've italicizes; this is interesting because objectively testing a procedure in a reproducible fashion is nearly the exact process of scientific inquiry. You're a moron.

[Hakaider]

SoCal Kung Fu,

Your reactions, cursing and insults as an MMA fan basically justifies everything i'm saying. You do realize you are representing yourself as an MMA fan right? Just look at your signatures. Your behavior actually gives people a snapshot of what an MMA fanatic acts like. Of COURSE, you can't understand what I mean by science or even history. I don't have the patience to explain it to you, since you are already so knowledgable about it.

Your anger and insults also proves there is some truth in what i'm saying. If what I am saying is not true, then why are you so angry. Deep down inside, am I questioning something you hold very dear to you. Hence, your anger. For a martial artist, you really have poor self-control. Is this what you learn in terms of personal conduct from your MMA classes? I guess from seeing the way Mcgreggor speaks at press conferences, I take that as a yes?

Yes, I have friends in many different martial backgrounds. Since, I did MMA in the past I have a some buddies from that area too. I am not sure what you mean black guy thing? Am I supposed to give you my real info and background, so you can fact check me. I totally would, but you seem a few cards short of a full deck. If I am an MMA guy who says he knows TMA people, is that some black guy thing too. You should be a comedian, since I find you quite hilarious. Am I supposed to avoid MMA people or something? I have had the same topic with people with MMA experience as well. At least they conduct themselves with decency.

I have no idea what a larp is... don't care to find out. It seems you know a lot about it.

I think you should take your own advice and do you. If you wanna be the UFC champ, then do you bro. If you feel I have hurt your precious MMA feeling then... Buy a Mcgreggor doll and hug it to sleep? Pray to MMA jesus?

Why spend life in a rage with someone. Go out and make those MMA dreams come true.

Alright, guys... I'm out for now.

[bawang]

did u just step out of a time machine lol

my wing chun sense also tingling

[Hakaider]

No time machines here.

I don't study wing chun, but I do think some aspects of it are useful.

Nice spiderman joke though...

As MMA grows in popularity there will be more analysis of it as a sport, culture and MA. Some people don't care, some people do.

After my experience with it, a lot of things were put into perspective.

But, I think Socal can provide you with answers you may find more favorable in terms of MMA opinions.

[bawang]

kung fu side effects are way worse than mma side effects.

wat is ur kung fu background?

[sanjuro_ronin]

Firstly, limiting rules doesn't mean you will be amazing with no rules. They are different sciences and focuses. If I say to you, our rules are limited to having a pillow fight. Just because you are the pillow fighting champion doesn't mean you can suddenly destroy people in a real fight. How you train is how you fight and what is possible involves a lot of study. Being good at limited rules doesn't mean you can suddenly beat others with expanded rules. It just means you are good at fighting a certain method. Science and knowledge with experience dictates everything. Your example is like me playing street fighter 3 third strike. I say to my friend, we can only shoot fireballs. He can beat me everytime. That's different from having a full on match in the game. If am used to using a wider range skillset and he has these fire ball matches, he will lose.

So much incorrect here..

lets see:

Firstly, limiting rules doesn't mean you will be amazing with no rules

.
Just as training without any real contact because it is too dangerous doesn't mean you will be able to fight with real contact.
The least amount of rules, the close to real fighting and MMA is as loce ot real fighting as we cna get without someone trying to kill us ( real fighting)

They are different sciences and focuses. If I say to you, our rules are limited to having a pillow fight. Just because you are the pillow fighting champion doesn't mean you can suddenly destroy people in a real fight.

No, but actually fighting, hitting and getting hit is far closer to anything we have.

How you train is how you fight and what is possible involves a lot of study. Being good at limited rules doesn't mean you can suddenly beat others with expanded rules. It just means you are good at fighting a certain method. Science and knowledge with experience dictates everything. Your example is like me playing street fighter 3 third strike.

This comment calls into question whether you have ever actually fought, for obvious reasons.

[Jimbo]

Hakaider:

In reference to typical MMA fighter vs. typical TCMA practitioner:

Of course we don't know every TMA or MMA practitioner. And I don't claim to know everything in MA, not even close. But I am making a judgment from what I've seen, both in the States and when I lived overseas and what I saw there. So I was careful to say 'typical MMA fighter' as opposed to just someone who goes to an MMA gym to burn calories during their office break. Like in any good TMA school, there are those in MMA who are fighters and those who are not.

Regarding number of different skills, IME one who has a few skills that are trained to second nature under pressure is generally much better off than someone with unlimited options who hasn't actually applied those techniques to their ultimate end against a resisting opponent. As effective as they can be, things like eye gouges and finger breaking cannot be purposely practiced to completion; at best they can only be approximated. OTOH, there are street people with no formal MA training at all who understand these types of tactics. Within the last couple of months in the city I live, a street person fought another man and tore one of his eyes out. Even many MAists who have practiced such things could possibly hesitate.

Sometimes too much quantity of technique and too many options creates overload under pressure. Quality (as opposed to over-quantity) of skills allows for versatility of what one does know in a variety of situations.

My personal experience is that over-intellectualizing MA is undesirable under pressure. Actions and reactions must bypass the intellect or you'll get caught, especially in a sudden, violent situation. Over-thinking causes hesitation. As the saying goes, "If you hesitate you'll meditate, in a horizontal position."

[B.Tunks]

Pretty sure it's some kid/kid-minded adult who's never fought a single bout under any rule set and has recently discovered TMA and done all of his training on the web/in the local bookstore (where they only stock Art of War, Tao of Jeet Kune Do and Book of Five Rings)...

[Hakaider]

Reply to Jimbo,

The issue you all seem to be saying is resistence.

Let me give you a good example:

Let's say you are want to be a chef. Ok, I give you all the tools (knives, chopping boards and so on and ingredients) to cook something. I put you into the kitchen and ask you to cook everyday. After 10 years you have some level of skill. But, it's not the highest level at all. It might even be poor.

Let's change the scenario. Let's say a highly trained italian chef who has deep knowledge trains you to master a rich tradition of skills. He gives you knowledge and asks you to cook as well. You master a science and have way more answers to culinary situations.

The last guy just memorizes a bunch of knowledge, but never practices. He can't cook very well, but in a kitchen he has some chance to at least create something, but lacks the experience. Obviously, he is not the most ideal. But, put under increased pressure, he will learn a lot a faster than an idiot who tries to just figure it all at as he goes.

There is fourth example, I put you in cooking competition with a reduced number of tools and no mastery of any deep cooking skills and ask you to become a high level cook from attending and focusing purely on these competitions

In other words,

MMA is not science in combat. It is a TOURNAMENT. It is not a fighting art. The levels of skill only come from mastery of knowledge. That is why TMA is infinitely valuable toward combat development. High level people will not get that way (combat mastery) from doing MMA tournaments. They need real knowledge mastery and science. That only comes from TMA.

If you don't have resistence training as a part of your CMA training, then you working with a fraud. All forms of TMA are different and not all of them use the same types of resistence. However, MMA doesn't prepare you for all the types of resistense as it is purely a fighting tournament. You will get resistence skills from scientific TMA study and then you can apply those skills in MMA, if you wish. However, since it is a sport, you are limited in expression of your skills. It is possible to design and create resistence that will prepare one greatly for a number of situations.

I study with my master and we always do resistence. We also study knowledge of other arts and spar against different types of martial artists. Learning is intellectual, not just getting swollen at the gym, hitting pads and then going into MMA. Again... MMA is not an MA. It has no science. It is only a tournament with rules for ENTERTAINMENT and not a fighting style or science.

Just because some schools are not intelligent enough to create, design and give high level resistense skills doesn't mean others don't. Just because there are many MA guys who don't do resistence doesn't mean the only guys who have it are MMA. I fight every other day. Hence, why I was able to win MMA matches.

The big issue with MMA is that a large amount of people in those tournaments aren't masters of anything. They went to MMA gyms for 2 or 3 years, got huge muscles and the MMA marketing machine claims they are worlds best combatants. It is slightly fraudulent and dishonest. But, it works for monetary reasons. It is also ****ed entertaining. Let's not fool ourselves, MMA is about money and entertainment. Martial science is not it's main purpose. It's main goal is put people into an octagon and make them fight. "Fighters" are expendable and injuries are life long. Pay is mediocre and glory lasts only as long as you don't lose. When Mcgregor loses, he will be scrubbed away from memory, just like Tito, Shamrock and many others... RR will not have a great film career or be a media queen, she will be thrown under a bus in this dark sport of drug use, profanity and entertaining violence. Everyone is already moving to the next expendable.

I don't think such TOURNAMENTS shouldn't exist. But, saying you are an MMA fighter doesn't mean much. The levels of fighters range widely and doing MMA doesn't make them somehow super human or an owner of deep knowledge. Let's not forget MMA has its fair share of mediocrity guys. Kimbo Slice in MMA didn't make him a high level knowledgable combatant...

Knowledge is important gentlemen

[bawang]

what is ur TMA background?

[boxerbilly]

I am a traditional martial artist.

I studied different styles growing up and hold a black belt in 2 styles.

I have a background several disciplines and still train regularly.

I am currently working as a bodyguard.

Like most, I watched the UFC in it's early days and was perplexed with the level of freedom and desire of those to express their artform. I remember when Jerry Springer did a show on it in the 1990's and described it as "brutal anything goes fighting competition." I watched it get blocked from access on American TV. I saw it re-emerge and explode with a new face and new rules. Seeing the return of UFC and then the amazing spectacle of Pride really made me excited. From 2006 - 2009, I saw forums like Sherdog become filled with MMA-aholics. I lurked and enjoyed the arguments that MMA was everything in combat and everything else was fake and useless. If you didn't admit that MMA was the king of combat, you were either from a "Mcdojo" or you suck at fighting. Those were hilarious times for me. Silat, Krav Maga, Kung Fu... it all seemed to be nothing compared to MMA. It got to the point where the only thing that could prove you had high level combative skill was to see your MMA fight record. If you had an undefeated or even good MMA fight record, you were considered a respected and high level combatant. Times have changed. People are not so insistent in MMA as being the end all be all of fighting, but the fans are truly still crazy about it.

Unfortunately, I didn't continue on the hype train. I lost my enthusiasm for it many years ago and stopped MMA as whole. What caused me to have this change of heart? Actually, joining MMA competitions and becoming a fighter. I have an undefeated record, not a high one 6W - 0L. But, my time in MMA was enought for me to analyze the sport in a way very few have. Not from a computer or armchair, but by actually doing it.

So, I want to provide a clear definition of MMA from someone who has both MMA and TMA experience. While I won't be returning to "study" MMA or compete, I hope this is useful and may lead to interesting debate:

1. MMA is NOT a Martial Art

Well it is taught to soldiers now so one could say it is martial .

2. MMA is not form of self defense

Wrong. You are being to myopic. It could make a very effective ender failing other options to escape or avoid.

3. Nearly any blending of martials art styles can be considered "MMA"

I agree but the term is universally accepted to what we watch on ppv.

4. It is very different from real life combat

Well tactics may differ but an elbow in the teeth is an elbow in the teeth. That's a **** target Billy. Wear leather !

5. MMA did not create nor can own the idea of cross training

Agree.

B. Bruce Lee... the "father" of MMA

Lee studied WC 12 or 13 years. Kano studied Jujitsu 5 and was considered a master at age 21. But Lee is not given similar respect because he told dudes they sucked to his face and smacked a few.



6. MMA is an entertaining SPORT

I find it boring a **** normally and skip it. The early UFC was exciting to watch. But occasionally it has been very exciting.

7. MMA is extremely dangerous and just not worth the risks (business and healthwise)

Pay tends to suck. But the top guys can make some cash now. But like all sport. Its only the top guys that make the cash.

I posted my replies under yours.

Now my definition of MMA is it is modern pankration.

[Hakaider]

Hello BoxerBilly,

Thank you for your reply.

I want to clarify a few things for you

Bruce Lee studying Wing Chun for 11 or 12 years is a myth and lie."The largest influence on Lee's martial arts development was his study of Wing Chun. Lee began training in Wing Chun when he was 16 years old under the Wing Chun teacher Yip Man in 1957, after losing several fights with rival gang members." -wiki

Bruce Lee escaped to America in 1959 after beating the leader of a triad gang who supposedly put out a price on Bruce's head. Anyone who does CMA knows that it doesn't matter how much you train, 2 years is a short time to develop deep science. After going to the US, he opened his "Bruce Lee Wing Chun school" without his master's blessing. After being winded in the WJM fight, he "quit" Wing Chun.

Others sources say he only studied for 1 year. However, he learned very fast. That is why his insult toward CMA was disrespectful when he himself was a gangster who learned very little of the science. He never mastered or finished out any martial science nor did he invent cross training. I respect his accomplishments, but he was a very well conditioned hypocrite. A lot of conditioning "secrets" and one inch punch theories were derived from mostly Chinese kung fu and internal science, which he never gave credit to. The fact that he was able to achieve such a level of skill from such a short time doing one type of Kung Fu should give credit to the science of CMA and TMA. Imagine if he actually fleshed out mastery of his system like Yip Man did. His level of depth and science would be very complex.

About MMA being taught to soldiers, since MMA can be a blend of anything and has no set curriculum it's not science or MA. It's a tournament based on a vague ideaology. Soliders are learning how to deal with what they may face on the battle field. Since, a lot of knuckle heads are watching UFC and trying to imitate what they see, all combatants should be familiar with common tactics used from those who have adopted an MMA mindset. That doesn't make it an MA. As a police officer put it: "There are thugs watching UFC and trying to hurt people. Police officers cannot afford to not be preparing for these guys." I couldn't agree more. Soldier CQC has a rich vast history and varies from country to country. There is deep methodology for hand to hand strategies utilized in war. It is different from tournament entertainment.

What we see on ppv doesn't make MMA an MA. If everyone in MMA started doing chicken leg dance fighting on ppv, that wouldn't suddenly legitimize it as martial science. It's just the current edition of what McMMA gyms are churning out to make money. In MMA, there is no real cohesiveness since it's a tournament and not an MA. It's supposed to "contain everything." However, if it looks like everyone is fighting the same, it's most likely due to the gyms giving everyone a similar subset of unmastered skills and low level science, then rushing them into an octagon after they are ripped. Just because everyone is doing something on ppv doesn't somehow make it high level martial science...